Massively^™

It's clear that this one was really made for the effect of Age of Conan and the amout of people that have complained about it's lying to the playerbase or whatever.

But, in the case of AoC, Funcom's developers (more specifically Earling Ellingson) actually did lie to the customers. For example, the Dx10 on the box, they admit that it was ment to be for saying "the game runs DX10 from the get go" but it never did and still doesn't run Dx10.

This one really got me: The PvP Gamespot Beta Weekend. Around this time we got a video from E.E. talking about the fansy PvP and the levels, XP, and gear. Come that Beta test weekend, we got to play the game and levels, XP, and gear were all in. When the game actually launched live...none of it was in....that was all a lie, but more so that was a bait-n'-switch. That's like giving a demo for Halo and releasing the product of Kane and Lynch; they're two completely different things and if the player buys based on a demo of stuff that's not in the real product, that's just straight out consumer fraud.

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Well... this article is about Age of Conan from the Funcom company. Their company sucks. I hope AOC burns with Hellgate...

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In other words, as the old adage goes, "Never confuse sales with delivery." Trouble is, people seem to fall for it again and again...and again. Perhaps there's something peculiar to the gamer psyche that means they blindly believe the marketing bullshit and fail to learn from their past experiences?

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I feel somewhat taken out of context.

The line "How do you trust someone when they lied/misled you?" was in response to why people do not give MMOs a second chance. Not about the general hype. Marketers lie? No excrement, Sherlock, have a cookie...

There are some MMOs that DO live up to their hype, they DO deliver on what they promised (LotRO for example) and engender loyalty and trust from their players.

Then there are other games that outright lie about features and have broken missing features/content (oh AoC, where did we go so wrong? Be quiet Vanguard, I'm still not talking to you) that were promised and hyped to be in game. It's not about "You will be the awesome hero and it will be a mmogasm experience" it's about "You will have a purple pony in this game the second you log in" only to never get said coloured equine. That's a lie, a fail, a betrayal, not hype.

Games do not engender loyalty when they continue to fail to live up to their own promises.

I played EQ1 for years. I am used to a company failing to live up to it's myriad of promises, so many things were coming soon and fixed soon and trickled in 3 years later at best or were never ever fixed/appeared. I thus treat any SOE game with immediate suspicion that I will be similarly treated as poorly.

You asked why people dont give second chances? Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. I'm not willing to continue to pay money and invest time in something that will not give me the reward I want. Or to a company I have no faith in (due to their own track record) to make good on promises and "fix" the game as they themselves promise?

Lupinus

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OK, apparently I have 2 accounts for Massively ;)

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Erling is the enemy of every single MMO player on this planet. That SOB brings the whole community down with his lies.

I would seriously consider returning to AoC if I saw a very public firing of him and the rest of the lead team on AoC, then I might start to believe that they are really trying to fix things.

Everyone knows MMOs go through "growing pains" but no one believes Failcom will make them with someone like Erling at the helm.

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I think the column author hit the nail right on the head actually Lupinus.

You keep saying things like "broken promises" and "betrayal" and he's saying "marketing blurb" and "advertising hype".

You sound like AoC/Funcom is a lover that spurned you. They aren't, they're a software provider that you feel didn't deliver according to your expectations. They may, or may not, still actually deliver on those specifications, but because you were "betrayed" I doubt you'd even give them a chance (and yes, they have delivered before from the same position).

Early adopters get bitten by a lot more things than just games my friend, if you don't like it, wait a few months after something comes out.

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Thanks to Funcom, SOE is looking good nowadays (thinking of what happened to SWG).

That aside, the line between fraud and not living up to expectations is imho pretty thin (think SWG NGE introduction). The thing is, if there is a big difference or not, no matter if it is a legal definition or whichever else, no one is going to sue a game company, because (the average) players couldn't afford to do so plain financially and time wise. And the companies know this, so they can continue to do without having to worry about committing fraud :(

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There's a difference between marketing blurbs and outright falsehoods and fraud.

There's some definite correlation with the spurned lover analogy, trust is gone. I dont see why that analogy is a bad thing, it's the same as any customer service for example. I'll never use certain products/services ever again after being misled over them in the past.

I cant trust them not to screw me over again, whether it's my old ISP (no, Telstra! Bad Telstra!), DVD players (Telefunken is bad, mmkay?), food outlets (bus port chinese = 2 days off work...) or MMOs (SOE = Bad, Turbine = Good).

The food place sold bacteria ridden food, the DVD players are just terrible, Telstra is overpriced, awful service. I'm never going back to any of them, even if they try to entice me back with half price day or even free. I, as a consumer, do not trust them to provide the service/goods I want anymore, so I'll go to another ISP/chinese/dvd player.

Having bad service from an MMO company, in the form of broken content, or content that was promised and not delivered does not constitute falling for marketing blurbs, especially when it is black and white a lie, and NOT marketing spin.

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"Tell ya what then... Sue them for false advertising and see where it gets you.

There is a big difference between "Didn't live up to expectations" and "Consumer Fraud""

Ah, and because we can't (or can't be bothered) to sue someone we can't possibly have a case?

Face it, AoC was hyped and talked about with a series of key features that weren't in at launch, including but not limited to:

- DX10 support (on the damned box)
- Massive PvP (on the damned box)
- PvP reward system

The failure of Funcom to deliver these features at launch, along with their persistent inability to deliver these features 3-4 months after launch, makes them liars in my eyes. I'm not exactly in the mood to QQ all over my nice new shoes but yes, I do feel pissed off at them.

Why? Well, taking my money and not delivering those features listed on the box of their product and in the associated advertising, and in the repeated failure of Funcom to provide the features after launch in a timely fashion or support what they already have.

Also, relax a little. That last article and comment make "ya" come across like a first grade asshat.

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It's a funny thing about the "gamer mentality" (especially MMO's), people just keep buying these games at launch, or even worse pre-ordering them before launch when the history is pretty clear that they just aren't going to be what they've been hyped to be (assuming they work at all, or are "feature complete"). I find it hilarious the talk about AoC when funcom had a far worse launch with Anarchy online, it didn't run at all. This is all history, I learned a long time ago not to buy these games on the hype/lies. You wait till it's been out and been played/reviewed then you get a demo (free!) and see for yourself if it's REALLY something you want to play (and pay for)

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Realistically, buying any based on a demo where the fine print (or the really big letters on the first or second screen) where it says that something is unfinished or that it may or may not represent the final product isn't fraud. Is it misleading? Not really. In fact in such a situation, you were warned it may not be the same come retail launch.

Is it annoying? Absolutely. But the alternative is pretty simple in this particular situation...

Most PC games run $50. Every MMO I've bought in the last 3-5 years comes with the first month as part of the purchase price. If I buy the game, play it, and decide I don't like it, I don't pony up $15 a month to continue bitching about it. I uninstall said application and relegate the box and disc to somewhere in my round file.

I don't necessarily cancel my account, I just don't renew my subscription. That way, if they fix the stuff or have a freebie weekend, I can just jump back in, try it out and re-examine my stance on it.

I didn't care for LotRO when it came out. I beta'd it for awhile and it just wasn't as fun to me as WoW was. However, I'm playing again because the game is much more fun now, for me, than it was at launch. The opposite is true for WoW now. I still my account, but the subscription isn't active. If something comes out that I want to try, I'm sure I'll re-activate it for a month or so and try it out again.

But really, while I understand everyone's, including my own, frustration with things... If you don't like it, stop buying. Or at least wait til one of your buddies ponies up the cash and try it on his box.

Or you could do like one poster here said: Try to sue them for fraud and see where it gets you...

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excellent article, i couldnt have put it better myself. the face of the MMO community is changing, to a point that its becoming a skewed version of the amercias need for instant gratification.
im glad someone is finally telling the whiners to think critically and stop complaining about everything.

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What I don't understand is why people consider bugs to mean that a game is a POS. I've played many, many MMOs (as many here have, of course) and while a lot of people have complained about bugs, that the game was "a paid beta test", etc., I continued to play on. If the game is a total train-wreck, if it's got bugs up the wazoo, if it's "unplayable", as so many people claim, then why was _I_ able to continue to play with the game is such a state? Usually, these "problems" are in the eye of the beholder. I have no tolerance for people who complain about a lack of "end game content" three days after a game's launch. These things have a planned lifespan of YEARS, and yet some people just blow through the whole thing, apparently so they can b1tch and moan.

Some people like the sound of their own voice too much. How many times have you seen someone trolling an MMO forum where they complain out one side of their mouth that they're SHOCKED that the game was released in such a buggy state, yet out of the other side they list their personal MMO pedigree as if it paints them an expert on the genre? What does that solve? Do these people expect that others will be in awe of their experience? Do they expect that a whole host of industry news outlets and bloggers will descend upon their houses to catch the pearls of wisdom that fall from their lips?

Kevin is right. No game has a perfect launch, and in this Internet age, none ever will. I would say that if you're an absolute noob to gaming in ANY genre, then your outrage is forgivable -- you probably don't know any better. But when you've grown up (which some people have yet to do) in the Internet Age, foul mouthed indignation over receiving a product who's very mandate is to be updated incrementally over time just paints you a a whiner who's looking for attention.

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Kevin, you are right that most sensible folk now wait until after release to buy a game, once the first month at least has passed and the 'truth' comes out from the actual player base.

The problem is this: I want to play a game at launch and I want it to be good.

This attitude of 'just expect it to be shit and don't buy it - shut your mouth because you didn't learn last time' doesn't help things at all! The trend is to release a crap product and that's what we expect now - why is that ok?!? People damn well should be QQ'ing up a storm because companies can't release a finished product, or at least one that includes what it's supposed to and works in a reasonable fashion (some server bumps etc can be expected.. to an extent).

Of course, maybe if people QQ'd and also didn't buy it, companies would listen - but then the QQ wouldn't count because people haven't played it.

Maybe it's idealism, but the best way to make money IMO is to make a good product. An honest company who doesn't make crap wouldn't have anything to worry about in giving open beta/demo/trial right at/before release. And until that happens, I will support QQ at these worthless companies who think that releasing crap products is just fine as long as they can put enough features on the box (but not in the game) so people will buy it.

Also, you are confusing hype and lying. It's one thing to say "Raisin Bran has amazing juicy raisins!" and really 1/500 in the box are juicy. Oh well, still not a lie. But to say "Raisin Bran has amazing juicy raisins!" and then there isn't a single f'ing raisin in the box - that's a lie and the consequent QQ is very justified.

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